IceCreamMan
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« Reply #90 on: February 08, 2010, 12:18:26 pm » |
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I think Satan would be a bit more subtle than using rock muso's to carry out his plans.
Satan was the angel of music ..non?
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X-rated Bob
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« Reply #91 on: February 08, 2010, 12:26:28 pm » |
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Other people don't like Santana? Oh. Interesting, thought it was just me. Clapton too, can't stand him. Instant narcolepsy (i.e. I hear him, I fall asleep.)
Clapton DID do great stuff - especially with Cream. He also labours under hype (which he did not seek) that nobody can live up to. I think he's pretty boring these days, but if somebody managed to light a spark then he might again show the form that made somebody write "Clapton Is God" on a wall in London. A few years ago I caught him on the Grammies doing a duet with BB King and there was a glimpse of the passion that he used to invest his guitar work with. I am always surprised at Santana's repuation - especially when people start talking about "latin rock". Santana is a blues player with a sweet, overdriven sound. I think he's a good player, but hardly a great one. I do think there is a tendency to fawn over just about anybody who made it through the 60s without ending up dead or insane (and a good few that did meet one of those fates). That's primarily driven by my generation, I think. But some of the hype IS true, and some of those players did do great work, even if the creative flame has long since flickered and died. Clapton, for example, has substantial laurels to rest upon.
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singemonkey
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« Reply #92 on: February 08, 2010, 12:59:56 pm » |
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Other people don't like Santana? Oh. Interesting, thought it was just me. Clapton too, can't stand him. Instant narcolepsy (i.e. I hear him, I fall asleep.)
Clapton DID do great stuff - especially with Cream. He also labours under hype (which he did not seek) that nobody can live up to. I think he's pretty boring these days, but if somebody managed to light a spark then he might again show the form that made somebody write "Clapton Is God" on a wall in London. A few years ago I caught him on the Grammies doing a duet with BB King and there was a glimpse of the passion that he used to invest his guitar work with. I do think there is a tendency to fawn over just about anybody who made it through the 60s without ending up dead or insane (and a good few that did meet one of those fates). That's primarily driven by my generation, I think. But some of the hype IS true, and some of those players did do great work, even if the creative flame has long since flickered and died. Clapton, for example, has substantial laurels to rest upon. Those British blues guitarists played the most insanely exciting, passionate lead guitar I've ever heard. The guys they imitated were perhaps more original. But the feel and fluency that Clapton, Green, and Taylor introduced was just incredible. Blues guitar players I hear now all have the chops, but they can't lift you. It's like they don't actually think that it's exciting, soulful music. They think it's a hobby. Or a craft or something. But when those guys were good it could seem like enlightenment would come round the next string-bend. That's why both Clapton and Green were called God. And Taylor wasn't far off either. Clapton now though? He has better chops, but without the fire, the aggression, the will to prove himself, he seldom reminds you of how he blew everyones' minds. But you listen to Steppin' Out on the John Mayall record. Holy sh%t. People have been called God for far less than that. Green of course can barely play guitar at all now. But when you hear I Need Your Love So Bad, or the incendiary solo on Lookin' Back, you get why his name and God were also sprayed on walls together. Taylor's now a grumpy old fat man. But listen to a bootleg of the Stones doing Midnight Rambler in the early seventies and he shows you what rock guitar is meant to be. fluit-fluit. My storie is uit.
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X-rated Bob
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« Reply #93 on: February 08, 2010, 01:33:40 pm » |
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Those British blues guitarists played the most insanely exciting, passionate lead guitar I've ever heard. The guys they imitated were perhaps more original. But the feel and fluency that Clapton, Green, and Taylor introduced was just incredible. Blues guitar players I hear now all have the chops, but they can't lift you. It's like they don't actually think that it's exciting, soulful music. They think it's a hobby. Or a craft or something. But when those guys were good it could seem like enlightenment would come round the next string-bend. That's why both Clapton and Green were called God. And Taylor wasn't far off either.
I used to have a John Mayall album with Taylor playing, and he was magical. His problem is that he's always been a side man, never an artist in his own right. Fab player. Meshed very well with Knopfler on a Dylan album that I recall hearing long ago. Infidels? You're not mentioning Gilmour. He's an interesting case because although he didn't emerge from quite the same scene as the others, he is a blues player at his core. Clapton now though? He has better chops, but without the fire, the aggression, the will to prove himself, he seldom reminds you of how he blew everyones' minds. But you listen to Steppin' Out on the John Mayall record. Holy sh%t. People have been called God for far less than that.
I'm quite rude about Clapton these days, but he's a big part of my falling in love with rock. Especially his work with Cream. The number that threw the switch for me was "White Room", and I loved "Tales of Brave Ulysses" as well. It took me a longer to get into his straighter blues stuff like "Crossroads" or "Sleepy Time Time". You're right, there was real fire in his playing then. A pity that the fire went out, but it often does. Not many guys have a creative flow that flows forever. We can still bear testimony to what he did, and if he never cuts another track he'll still deserve the label "great". Same with Green, though he never reached the level of fame and hype that Clapton did. Just a fab player, and I think his work in the 60s is finally starting to get the recognition that it deserves.
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Squonk
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« Reply #94 on: February 08, 2010, 01:47:13 pm » |
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I'm quite rude about Clapton these days, but he's a big part of my falling in love with rock. Especially his work with Cream. The number that threw the switch for me was "White Room", and I loved "Tales of Brave Ulysses" as well.
I enjoyed these two tracks as well, I started out with Live Cream and Live Cream Vol II, I preferred the live albums to the studio ones. Although I haven't heard it for at least 30 years. But like you say, he did enough to prove that he is one of the greats.
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chris77
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« Reply #95 on: February 08, 2010, 01:55:28 pm » |
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Wow. Reading those Clapton comments is like a kick in the nuts. I reckon thats how it feels if somebody points out to you that you have an ugly baby. I really like his newish stuff as well and if not more than his early work. Some of my favourite songs ever are on Pigrim and From the Cradle. Unplugged is just Epical. Its the stuff inbetween that was k@k imo.
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X-rated Bob
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« Reply #96 on: February 08, 2010, 02:14:42 pm » |
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Wow. Reading those Clapton comments is like a kick in the nuts. I reckon thats how it feels if somebody points out to you that you have an ugly baby. I really like his newish stuff as well and if not more than his early work. Some of my favourite songs ever are on Pigrim and From the Cradle. Unplugged is just Epical. Its the stuff inbetween that was k@k imo.
I think he has upped his game a bit, but he's still nowhere near his 60s form. You get occasional flashes of it. I recall hearing a cut from a live Babyface show where I thought - in quick succession - "That's one smoking solo" and "That's Clapton". He kicked into magical form on Roger Waters "Pros and Cons of Hithchiking". One problem I think he has is that he doesn't get good material these days. When he was a member of a band he could shine as a soloist - even with Cream this was the case - but when he has to make it all happen himself or rely on pro songwriters then things get harder for him. This may be why the live discs seem better - he can draw on a lot of great songs that he has performed over the years. There's also the point that Singemonkey makes - that of passion. Back in the 60s Clapton really wasn't kidding. There was passion, sometimes fury in his playing. These days he might actually be a technically better player, but it too often sounds like he's going through the motions.
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chris77
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« Reply #97 on: February 08, 2010, 04:23:05 pm » |
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Thanx Bob. I have a Yardbirds compilation and a Cream reunion cd, recorded 2thouanadsomething at the Royal Albert. I didnt give either a fair listen to at the time, I just skipped through the tracks. Seems like I will have to rectify that...
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eschew obfuscation.
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PeteM
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« Reply #98 on: February 08, 2010, 04:34:07 pm » |
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These days he might actually be a technically better player, but it too often sounds like he's going through the motions.
I disagree with this - I think that he is a better overall musician - and plays with a subtle deep expression that perhaps not many people 'get'. In his current playing I feel his pain and I can also relate to his 'sense of knowing' - which maybe only comes with age.
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Guitar Teacher, muso, corporate video writer/producer/director, voice-over artist Guitars: Gibson ES330TD, Cort CEC-5 nylon acoustic, Yamaha CG170-SA Classical, Harmony Stella 12 string H912, Yamaha bass SB-1C, Aria mandolin, hand made cuatro. Amps: Roland Cube 60, Meazzi Manager Recording hardware/software: Audigy XFier, Sony Vegas Pro 8, Audition
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zohn
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« Reply #99 on: February 22, 2010, 11:21:21 am » |
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I agree with some of the Clapton comments - I think he lost the magic judging by his playing now - it is as if his playing has never grown. What has happened though, is (in my view) he matured as a writer - very evident in his later blues acoustic tracks like "Circus", "Needs his woman" "Change the world", and a couple others. He is always surrounded by excellent players like Andy Fairweatherlow, Steve Gadd and Nathan East which helps, and he is one guy who can make a Martin 000-42 sound veeeery cool. He is by no means my least favourite guitarist - "God?" - absolutely no. I share Bob's view on Carlos Santana - recon I've listened enough of him for this lifetime.
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X-rated Bob
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« Reply #100 on: February 22, 2010, 11:25:44 am » |
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In defence of any guitarist who has been playing for... I dunno more than 10 years with real purpose, the graph is not a linear one. The good guys tend to make a lot of progress early on, and after that there is refinement but when you've hit a considerable high already the further gains takle a lot longer. Another application of the 80:20 rule.
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Tokai SA
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« Reply #101 on: February 24, 2010, 03:46:44 pm » |
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Who is your least favourite Guitarist or band. And why. Local and international. International Nickleback, Chad Kroeger 3 Doors Down guitarist Zack Wylde (I really dont think these guys are great but thats just me) Nickleback are predictable and the same every song. I wont bring up another guitarist as in an old thread of mine risked death.....  Local Walt Prime Circle Crash Car burn A very negative thread filled with bad Karma...IMO
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Jack Flash Jr
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« Reply #102 on: February 24, 2010, 05:15:28 pm » |
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Who is your least favourite Guitarist or band. And why. Local and international. International Nickleback, Chad Kroeger 3 Doors Down guitarist Zack Wylde (I really dont think these guys are great but thats just me) Nickleback are predictable and the same every song. I wont bring up another guitarist as in an old thread of mine risked death.....  Local Walt Prime Circle Crash Car burn Does it make you feel good criticizing other guitarists and bands...you tend to use the word "hate" a lot? It just seems so negative, such bad Karma...and it cant have any positive affect on your growth as a guitarist or musician. The saloon doors bang open... the piano guitar player stops mid-song and raises an eyebrow. Bartender reaches for shotgun under the counter...
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MIKA the better one
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« Reply #103 on: February 24, 2010, 05:53:16 pm » |
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wow I missed that comment, yeh straight up, this whole hateful thread has absolutley no point whatso ever, much like most threads, or further more nothing constructive, Consider Schpoenhaur and his view that EVERYTHING in this world is either to spread you sead or destroy. I dont plan to have children with any of these guitarists i mentioned so I guesse its destructive. If you could remove karma points I would be winnng on the minus points
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Tokai SA
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« Reply #104 on: February 24, 2010, 07:45:40 pm » |
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I'm interested in your opinion of lets say... David Gilmour Paul Koseff Jeff Beck Clapton Hendrix Van Halen Andy Timmons...plays Ibanez as well. Steve Vai ( you said you don't like G3, so I guess you don't think much of Vai and Satriani...and they play Ibanez, so that rules them out.
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